Psions now freeze when using the internet

[cshandley]

Hello all,

This thread is for discussing what seems to be a SERIOUS new problem with our
Psions, or more specifically the ISPs we use to connect to the internet. Even
if you do not understand all the technical issues, I request that you still post
your own experiences & ideas :-)

Description of problem
++++++++++++++++++++++
In addition to myself, many other Psion users have said they recently have
problems using the internet for Email, Web, Opera, nICQ, etc. They connect OK,
but after a few seconds or minutes their Psion freezes-up. Often the only
solution is a soft reset.

The problem covers all EPOC-based Psions (e.g. Netbooks, 5mxs, Revos) and even
the Epoc Emulator. It only happens when the Psion actually dials-up the
internet using a modem, whether this be 56K, 33K, or even a mobile phone (GSM).
PCs, Macs, etc are not affected. Connecting to the internet through a PC, or
via broadband, is unaffected (works fine). Only some ISPs seem to be affected,
but it seems that more are being affected every week! :-(


Results & ideas so far on the cause
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It has been suggested that the problem may be due to ISP upgrades to support
V92, but this seems less likely given that 33K & even 9.6K (GSM mobile phones)
are affected. Because all internet apps are affected, it seems unlikely to be
anti-virus measures taken by the ISP, but obviously something at the ISPs end
has changed.

The fact that all Psion devices and even the Emulator are affected suggests that
the problem occurs at a very high level in the EPOC OS, i.e. not a modem
driver, but instead perhaps the TCP/IP stack itself.


For myself, I have noticed that physically disconnecting the modem (PCMCIA) in
my Netbook or switching-off the Psion (both Netbook & Emulator) unfreezes the
machine. Unplugging the phone line does NOT unfreeze it. This seems to show
that EPOC freezes-up when talking to the modem, and that only by physically
disabling the modem will EPOC become unfrozen.

While my Netbook seems to have frozen, the Emulator (on an 800Mhz CPU) is not
*quite* frozen, so that if I am VERY patient, I can tell it to disconnect from
the internet (Ctrl-U). Once disconnected, it becomes unfrozen. This suggests
that EPOC is not frozen, but rather just "busy looping" to eat all the available
CPU time.

That the "busy looping" stops anything else from running indicates that the busy
task is at a very high priority (part of the System kernel), and the TCP/IP
stack would nicely fit this.

So the TCP/IP stack, or a closely associated piece of the kernel, seems to be
the likely candidate. The problem is that I am not technically knowledgable
enough to make any further tests, or how we might fix it. If you know of an
Epoc/Symbian wizard, get them to read this thread! :-)

It would also be interesting to see if Symbian-based (ER6/7) phones, using
dial-up rather than GPRS, are affected.


It is also not clear whether this fault is truely down to the EPOC OS, or
whether the ISP is doing something very bad which the designers of EPOC never
expected.

---
Chris Handley

[PhilAP]

Hi Chris,

This is happening on my 5mx, though it rarely needs a soft reset. Switching off usually seems to cure it temporarily. I didn't realise it was a general problem, I thought I was doing something wrong :( .

My ISP is Tiscali. My (new to me) 3c doesn't seem to have this problem using the PsiMail eMail client nor does my Mac (which has always been a bit flaky anyway). That's partly why I thought it was me.

I hope it's not a serious problem and that affected ISPs will resolve it but I'm not sanguine about it. Most will probably say it's our fault or that we should get more modern Micros**t computers (I jest not) :mad: .

[markdeppe]

Not really helpful but I Use claranet with netbook + mobile phone + and goldcard daily and have no problems.

As it does it with the emulator also I imagine using "TheDialer" software to make the connection makes no difference.

Keep us posted, hope you solve it as if it were something to start affecting all psion user that would be the death of us. Do I detect a conspiracy theory in there of MS realeasing an epoc virus getting us to ditch Epoc and all go out and buy a new netbookpro with windows. Paranoid of losing my safe psion, me, never.

[donkeyontheedge]

I first noticed this only this week when I was trying to send a mail with an attachment from Heathrow airport. I don't normally send attachments but this was a Word file I'd converted with nConvert. I assumed it was a problem with the attachment or the fact that it took me ages to get a connection to my ISP. Wasn't a big attachment, only 5k or so.

Anyway, since then I regularly freeze when using my IR phone (Nokia 6210 on Vodafone) to check/send mail on my 7book. I use Tiscali by the way, one of the old "psion.net" accounts.

Perhaps someone should compile a table of Machine/Modem/ISP etc to see if there is anything linking them?

John

[Jim Cooke]

I wonder if this a UK/European problem only or if it's more widespread? I use Earthlink in the US and, knock on wood, have had no problems with picking up my e-mail. I also have a Compuserve account that was working but now gives the same type of freezes you've all described. Knowing Compuserve and their propensity to change login scripts every week or so, I had written it off to yet another CS glitch but now I wonder. I see the same behavior on both my Mako and 5mx using the IR Travel Modem.

[Stevemorton]

Yes I have also been suffering this problem with both a mobile phone (Nokia 7110e) and a line modem USR Sportster Vi

The machine logs in ok, and then will freeze most often when downloading the headers.

At first I thought it was the 'slow' response of my CF card compared to the internal memory, but shifting my message stack to C hasn't solved the problem.

Sometimes disconnecting the modem or closing the call, solves the problem, but 9 times out of 10 it needs a soft reset.

I even tried a full hard reset and restore the other day, but no change.

I'm using BTOpenworld via either their PAYG number or their International Dial Up number (0121 478 9300)

Likewise no problems when connecting to the net via my PC using Mocha PPP, which works very well.

If any one knows of a solution to these recent lockups let's hear them... I'm getting tired of reseting my screen settings each time I do a softreset.....

Steve

[Simon Chadwick]

Well it was me that started this on the Epoc Digest... we have a 5mx and a netbook and both freeze most times we try and use Freeserve Anytime (free 0808 number). However no problems with Freeserve No Ties (local rate number).

[MikeMcC]

I have to say it seems rather bizarre that, all of a sudden, Psion users are having these connection problems with a variety of ISPs and with different modems - landline and mobile.

So far, I have been unable to reproduce the problem and I've just tried "Tiscali" (one of the problem ISPs) with both IR Travel Modem and mobile GSM connection. It worked perfectly, but the one thing I have never used is Opera so whether having this installed could be a contributing factor, I don't know. There are certainly reported issues of being unable to connect directly from Opera, which does suggest it fails to integrate properly with the Psion dialup software.

As a possibly futile exercise, can I ask those with the problem to try adding S10=50 to their "init (reset) string". What this will do is to prevent short bursts of noise on the line, or carrier interruptions, from forcing the connection to hang up and allow 5 seconds for things to return to normal. Doing this won't cause problems with your dialup - I've just tested it with both landline and mobile connections.

ATZ would become ATZS10=50
AT&F becomes AT&FS10=50

[Simon Chadwick]

Sorry Mike, crashed first time I tried the new settings... maybe I'll uninstall Opera and try... Simon

[MikeMcC]

Originally posted by Simon Chadwick
Sorry Mike, crashed first time I tried the new settings... maybe I'll uninstall Opera and try... Simon Oh well, it was worth a try. It was something I stumbled on in Tiscali's "help" pages but obviously the problem lies elsewhere :rolleyes:

Did it actually "crash" or did it "freeze" in the same way as it has been doing?

Thanks for the feedback.

[Stevemorton]

No difference here either Mike. And for the record I'm not using Opera on my machine.

I have discovered Sysback today though, which restores the system setting a lot quicker than I have been able to before :)

[MikeMcC]

No difference here either Mike. And for the record I'm not using Opera on my machineWell that at least rules out another possibility.I have discovered Sysback today though, which restores the system setting a lot quicker than I have been able to before I couldn't live without it :)

[PhilAP]

Hi,

Just tried again (I'm a real glutton for punishment) - same story.

For what it's worth my Psion sometimes freezes using:
Email,
Web,
RMRFTP,
Timekeeper,
NetUtils,
Opera and
Snaffle.
I haven't tried EPOCSync, WAP or XJMail. I don't know whether JTelNet or Hermes are relevant but I haven't tried them either or Comms.

My ISP is Tiscali and I use a 3Com U. S. Robotics 56K Faxmodem and a landline. The same problem does not occur using my Mac with the same modem and line. As far as I am aware it doesn't happen either using my 3c and the Psion Travel Modem (it certainly hasn't yet but I rarely use the 3c as it's a reserve machine mostly).

The Psion sometimes drops the connection and sometimes something in the OS closes so I have to reset the Psion (soft, thank goodness) to use it on the 'Net again. I can't remember what closes but the Psion does tell me and no I'Net program I've tried will work - but everything else seems to. I can't reliably recreate the problem - it seems to be intermittent. NetUtils froze on traceroute about hop 6 - a Tiscali address.

I don't really understand I'Net protocols, etc., yet so this is very much a suck-it-and-see approach but it might help someone else.

[MikeMcC]

Phil,For what it's worth my Psion sometimes freezes using: Email, Web, RMRFTP, Timekeeper, NetUtils, Opera and Snaffle.The application shouldn't matter because they all establish the connection initially with the Psion's built-in dialup software - hence the reason "The Dialer" can be used to connect before launching any internet app.My ISP is Tiscali and I use a 3Com U. S. Robotics 56K Faxmodem and a landline.OK, I will give it another try with Tiscali and my "3Com U. S. Robotics 56K Faxmodem" and see what happens - that's the same external modem I have connected to this PC.

[MikeMcC]

OK, I will give it another try with Tiscali and my "3Com U. S. Robotics 56K Faxmodem" and see what happens - that's the same external modem I have connected to this PCWorked alright - opened several pages with 'Web'; opened, checked and closed several mailboxes; retrieved an email from one mailbox.

This was with Tiscali's PAYG number - 0845 661 4681

:confused: :confused:

[PhilAP]

Hi Mike,

I'm :confused: too. It certainly shouldn't be individal programs but I've been around too long and seen too much to make that assumption. When suddenly the right indicator sounds the horn and the culprit is the voltage regulator then sense has taken a day off!

But you're almost certainly right. The NetUtils traceroute might help. So when I next use the 5mx on the 'Net I'll try that and log and post the results.

Maybe it's a problem with the immediate host which would explain why some get it and others don't. And also why it isn't consistent. Sometimes you're connected through different servers maybe? I'd consider that approach necessary but my knowledge is rather old hat now (who else remembers inband and outband).

So maybe PAYG accounts (or Scottish accounts) go through a clean server where Tiscali's concerned.

And the car was an Austin Cambridge, I'm that old.

[MickKi]

Hi All,

I have had the same problem with Virgin.net on an 0845 number. I have noticed that it will connect to the Virgin pop server using Email and copy messages usually without freezing, but as soon as I try to send a message it will invariably freeze trying to connect to Virgin.net's SMTP server. The funny thing is that occasionally, albeit rarely, it will connect to receive and send without freezing up:confused:

With Opera it will usually freeze up after a few minutes of browsing. The same story goes for connecting using a 3Com U. S. Robotics 56K Faxmodem, or a Siemens S35i (on GSM of course); but as Chris says I have had no problem connecting my Psion to the internet via the PC, using the same dial up number.

I moved on to BBinternet (http://www.bbinternet.net/) who offer a low contention dial up and am happy that it is faster and does not freeze up my 5mx. But from what I am reading re. changes implemented by various ISP's I wonder how long this might last . . .

I captured a couple of logs to see what was happening and found out in the POP, SMTP logs that Email would not even log on to the mailservers. In the Etel log I found inconsistent messages (I remember a line with loads of ******)?! I have send an email to Virgin.net customer service, but only got an automated reply. When I get some time I'll log some more attempts and publish them here.

Often, when the Psion freezes I get a "SocketServer, Kernexec 3" error. Is it that the Psion cannot handle the comms through the server sockets?

Did anyone get a sensible reply from their ISP's?

Regards,

Mick

PS. I have also heard about the v92 spec. which some ISP's will/are implementing it wholly, or partially, but I was thinking that it should be backwards compatible?

[MikeMcC]

Originally posted by MickKi
I have had the same problem with Virgin.net on an 0845 number. I have noticed that it will connect to the Virgin pop server using Email and copy messages usually without freezing, but as soon as I try to send a message it will invariably freeze trying to connect to Virgin.net's SMTP server.Just tried Virgin, sent a message with their SMTP server, opened several mailboxes, retrieved mail. No problems. This is with a PAYG account but I don't have their 0845 number, only an STD one. It seems the only way to find out the 0845 number is for Virgin to configure your PC's Dial Up Networking for you - no chance! I certainly couldn't find the number on their website.

I know these freezes are frustrating for users but I'm finding it frustrating that I cannot replicate the problem! There has to be a common factor at the Psion end. I cannot believe that the ISP industry has all of a sudden changed its connection protocols (Blueyonder's V.92 implementation excepted).

[MickKi]

Hi Mike,

I wanted to keep things simple with Virgin.net and changes in their servers, but here are some details which I am not sure if they matter.

When I started using Virgin.net their mailservers were pop.virgin.net and smtp.virgin.net. Now I see on their website they are using mail.virgin.net
The phone number I have been using is 0845-4550280. Perhaps now they have changed their numbers to STD's?
Primary DNS address: 194.168.4.100
Secondary DNS address: 194.168.8.100

I don't think that their changing the server is relevant (I have tried their new server with no success), however I have just come across one of their bulletins which may explain some:

Some customers may currently be experiencing problems with their PC arising from a Windows vulnerability resulting in a virus infection. For more information on this please call our freephone suport line on 0800 052 4329. If you think your machine has been infected, please go to http://microsoft.com/ and click on the link on the top right hand side of the screen. (In red)

The above article refers to the virus or worm known as "Blaster" or "Welchia". A known affect of these worms is that it has the potential to seriously degrade network performance. To combat this and to protect our service Virgin.net need to take action. We, along with a number of other ISP's, have temporarily blocked traffic associated with the Welchia worm (ICMP 8 - Echo) at our borders, this will prevent traffic generated by the worm from disrupting our equipment and services. The result should be better performance for all of our customer and help to remove the threat in the long term. We will review this decision daily and will remove the block once we believe we can do so without adversely impacting on our customers. (From Virgin.net website, the emphasis is mine)

Is this "ICMP 8 - Echo" that the ISP's block then, what is causing our Psion's to go loopy?

Regards,

Mick

[MikeMcC]

Mick,
When I started using Virgin.net their mailservers were pop.virgin.net and smtp.virgin.net. Now I see on their website they are using mail.virgin.netThese are all aliases which will ultimately be resolved to a numerical DNS address, in the case of "mail.virgin.net" - 62.253.164.40 - though they probably have several. You should be able to use the numerical address as the server in the 'Email' app.The phone number I have been using is 0845-4550280. Perhaps now they have changed their numbers to STD's?No, I just happen to have an STD number going back to a time when these were being sought for use with "free" minutes on mobile phones where 0845 didn't qualify.Is this "ICMP 8 - Echo" that the ISP's block then, what is causing our Psion's to go loopy?This is "pinging", the first step something like MSBlast will use to find vulnerable PCs connected to the internet. ISPs blocking this shouldn't affect Psion connectivity [...unless anyone knows otherwise ;) ]

[KevinMillican]

I've investigated this problem as follows :-

1. I can verify the problem on Tiscali dialing out directly with the netBook. It occurs after a random amount of time.

2. The problem does not occur on the same ISP when connecting via ICS (Microsoft's Internet Connection Sharing) using my 802.11b network.

A quick visit to http://scan.sygate.com will illustrate why there is a difference:

A. Using the WiFi connection, the netBook is protected from scanning via the Windows XP firewall; the 'Stealth Scan' reveals that all ports are 'Blocked'.

B. When I connect the netBook directly through its Gold Card Modem and run the same test, most of the ports are 'Closed', ie. they are not open but they are responding to scanning packets.

This means that the machines are targeted by scanning programs. The netBook is not really at any risk since there aren't any ways to exploit the ports (hence in the past there's been no need to block them!)

Unfortunately, many of the current attacks are designed to run malicious code on target PCs through TCP/IP buffer overrun vunerabilities. These will fire packets of data at the current IP address in the hope of exploiting these loopholes.

I suspect that the Psion's TCP/IP stack is just suffering from an overload that 'apparently' hangs the machine (but in actual fact just slows it right down to the point where it doesn't seem to respond)

The randomness in length of connection time is therefore just down to luck and how long it takes for the rogue program(s) to locate the apparently weak IP address.

Now what we need is for Psion or someone else to release an upgrade to the Psion's TCP/IP stack, or produce a firewall, so that this problem is dealt with.

[MickKi]

Thanks Kevin,

Most comprehensive reply indeed.The randomness in length of connection time is therefore just down to luck and how long it takes for the rogue program(s) to locate the apparently weak IP address. Hmm, how does this explain that Psion only hangs when I use Virgin.net, not when I use BBinternet as my ISP? With BBinternet I can stay online for hours without any apparent problem. When browsing I use an anonymous public proxy with Opera 5.14 to mask my IP address.

Also, would you know what the SocketServer error means?

Regards,

Mick

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by MickKi
Hmm, how does this explain that Psion only hangs when I use Virgin.net, not when I use BBinternet as my ISP? With BBinternet I can stay online for hours without any apparent problem.
Two possibilities:-

1. Possible that some ISPs are putting in filters for certain port scans or originating IP addresses, or

2. Some ISPs may be less favourable from a hacker's point of view, eg. built-in email scanning - thus less likely to be a trojan running that can be exploited on the users' machines.

In your case, BBinternet is far less well known than Tiscali, Virgin etc. so it may be outside the range chosen for scanning.

When browsing I use an anonymous public proxy with Opera 5.14 to mask my IP address.
That won't help you against a random scan of IP addresses; it only prevents sites you access from finding your true address.

Also, would you know what the SocketServer error means?
KernExec 3 is a common error in EPOC C++ programs - just means that the program's crashed from your point of view. 'SocketServer' is just the thread (program) that crashed. This is the bit that is used to read and write to TCP/IP and UDP ports.

[PhilAP]

Hi,

Kevin's post seems to me to make absolute sense. I hope nobody minds that I copied the "meat" of it (no address) to the "Tiscali Customer Feedback" forum. Particularly I hope Kevin doesn't mind as his explanation is better than any I could manage!

It seems the effect is to slow Psion's down to a very slow crawl but not otherwise affect them. But Windoze machines without some kind of protection are vulnerable. Since Windoze machines are the most prevalent I expect Tiscali (and other affected ISPs) to make an attempt to block this attack - and they might. If it affects their income adversely they ought to respond by protecting us as well as Windoze users.

Or is that terribly naive of me?

But they might take the attitude that it's not their responsibility, that everyone should have firewalls. If Tiscali do I'll see what can be done about progressing the matter further. After all, we're not at fault here.

[Stevemorton]

Firstly thank you for the replies and responses from our dare I say it 'experts' I think we have all learn't a lot from the investigations as to the recent freezes that have in my case anyway almost made my Psion unusable for Email.

But is there a cure for this problem? I suspect Psion aren't going to leap to our aid, is there a 3rd party dialer that can overcome this problem?

I must admit the problem is fairly repeatable in my case, be it with a mobile phone or line modem, and each time a soft reset and sysback seems to get me back to where I was before. But having had the machine for 4 years and only a handful of resets in that time. To have to do it virtually every time I check email is starting to make me think of looking else where.....

Any thoughts on where we go from here?

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by Stevemorton
But is there a cure for this problem? I suspect Psion aren't going to leap to our aid, is there a 3rd party dialer that can overcome this problem?
....
Any thoughts on where we go from here?
Firstly, I notice from my firewall logs that there has been a bit of a falloff in this type of scanning in the last few days - it's possible that the problem may decrease in intensity as hackers look at alternatives (as the various loopholes are patched).

Secondly, yes there are at least two course of action open :-

1. Get someone to revise the TCP/IP stack and release it as an upgrade.

2. Determine the ports that are causing the problems and run a separate comms program to intercept (and ignore) these rogue packets so that the ports don't respond.

[MickKi]

Hi All,

I would humbly suggest that Psion ought to pick this up and update their software with a patch. However, I would not hazard a guess as to how difficult it might be to interest them in developing and providing a fix. I wonder, is it time for another petition?!;)

As Kevin suggests it may well blow over in a couple of weeks, as either ISP servers and, or Windoze machines are secured.2. Determine the ports that are causing the problems and run a separate comms program to intercept (and ignore) these rogue packets so that the ports don't respond. This may provide a short term relief, if the ports scanned are consistent, but hackers may either scan at random or change the ports after a while?

Do Psion know about this problem? If anyone has contacts within Psion, perhaps could ask them what they are thinking/planning/doing about it?

Regards,

Mick

[roy.rogers]

Just for the record, my MC218's both now freeze using the email client + so does my Ericsson R380s - both using Tiscali.
Had it not been for the Epoc digest routing me here I would never have known it was a general problem.
Roy.R@orange.net
Essex,UK

[hughlook]

This first happened to me when I was roaming & *had* to get to my email...dreading my next mobile bill.

This may not be relevant, but at Mike's suggestion in another place I swapped to GPRS (Orange, using a 6310i): interestingly, haven't had a freeze since, even during receiving large attachments. Could be coincidence, of course.

Opera also works over a long session without freezing.

I realise this doesn't help people with Travel Modems etc, but it may be of diagnostic interest.

Hugh

[roy.rogers]

I want to thank the experts for the advice, but am unable to use GPRS on my trusty old Ericsson R380s which freezes most times I download with Tiscali using my orange free minutes.

Can someone recommend and give me an idiots guide to a different UK isp for using with the Ericsson R380s plus my Ericsson MC218 (psion 5mx wannabee).

Many thanks in advance ,
Roy.R (Essex)

[MikeMcC]

I suggested to someone using one of the "problem" ISPs that he try FreeUK - www.freeuk.com (http://www.freeuk.com) - for his internet access and for sending mail. So far he hasn't had the "freeze" issue with them and, of course, existing mailboxes and email addresses can still be used. FreeUK have a good help page with all of the necessary settings on, but ask again if you get stuck.

[cshandley]

Kevin suggested it might be possible to write some software to open the relevant port & ignore whatever it recieves. If this is really all it would take (sounds too easy to me) then:

It might be easiest for someone to write a little Java program, since that natively handles the internet & can be easily tested on Windows/etc.

The problem now is finding someone knowledgable enough about the internet & Java. They don't necessarily need to know anything about Psions! :-)
---
Chris Handley

[PhilAP]

Hi,

At
http://www.tiscali.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?threadid=49243
the Tiscali Narrowband Product Manager wrote:
"With regards your query I have raised it to the relevant team here to query the ports which could be blocked with minimal negative impact to maintain high levels of security. If you have a specific suggestion as to the port number or other details then please feedback with your information." Apparently you have to be a registered Tiscali customer to access this directly.

Here I can't help at all but maybe someone else can. Also any other ISP that generates the same problem might benefit from this data.

[MickKi]

Originally posted by cshandley
. . . It might be easiest for someone to write a little Java program, since that natively handles the internet & can be easily tested on Windows/etc. . . . The thing with Java is that it is heavy on resources and some Psions could well grind to a halt, especially when using Opera . . . err, hold on a minute that's what happens now :D (albeit for a different reason).

It appears that as times have moved on, our Psions need a more modern TCP/IP stack, which caters for hackers' tricks (buffer overflow) and, or an EPOC firewall!

I wish I knew how to develop either . . .:confused:

Regards,

Mick

[roy.rogers]

Thanks Mike for recommending I stop tiscali and try FreeUK.

I have had success on the Smartphone Ericsson r380s which hasnt frozen since. I was having to remove the battery each time as it was really frozen.

WHen I can get near my palmtop I will try in on there too.
Thanks

[cshandley]

Do Ericsson r380s use a modified ER5? Rather than ER6?

In which case, it is not surprising that they freeze, since it seems to be ER5 that has the 'bug'. I'd really like to know if the P800 (etc) also have problems freezing, when using dial-up (not GPRS).

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by cshandley I'd really like to know if the P800 (etc) also have problems freezing, when using dial-up (not GPRS).
It doesn't seem to happen on the Nokia 9210i but I only connect that across GSM

[netBookBabe]

Originally posted by cshandley
I'd really like to know if the P800 (etc) also have problems freezing, when using dial-up (not GPRS). Tried a test dial-up to BT Openworld last night, using the netBook and P800. Connected fine, navigated around Psion Place, displaying all images, plus a couple of other fairly demanding sites. Admittedly I only used it for about 10 minutes (don't want to run the cellphone bill up TOO much!) but no freezing or sluggish behaviour. This is in stark contrast to previous tests run over the past 2-3 weeks, where I consisently got an instant freeze upon launching Opera, when connected via BT OW.

The only difference in my set up is the change from Ericsson R520m phone to the the P800 - can't see how that can have any bearing on this specific situation. Incidentally, for anyone interested, the P800 doesn't require any different settings on the Psion in order to connect - it responds happily to my R520m configuration.

I still have no problems with my own regular ISP, PlusNet. Haven't yet tried a dial-up to BT Openworld on the P800 itself - I'll do that next!

Julie

[cshandley]

Originally posted by netBookBabe
The only difference in my set up is the change from Ericsson R520m phone to the
the P800 - can't see how that can have any bearing on this specific situation.


Interesting. My Netbook still freezes with SECONDS of connecting. However,
that is using the 0800 number. With the 0845 number it manages long enough to
get my email, so I'm not totally paralysed.

There seems to be a pattern that "free" numbers (i.e. unmetered 0800) are far
worse than their "pay and go" numbers (i.e. 0845). I have no idea why that
should be.


I still have no problems with my own regular ISP, PlusNet. Haven't yet tried a
dial-up to BT Openworld on the P800 itself - I'll do that next!
Testing the P800 itself, thus ER6/7, would be great.

P.S. Julie, missed you today at Epoc Chat :-( Was quite busy though.

Regards,
Chris Handley

[MikeMcC]

I've just been playing with another user's Commsdb.dat file to try to solve a problem connecting to CompuServe. Having established a connection, I checked my (normally unused) Virgin mailbox to discover a message from them apologising for their recent poor performance - "due to a number of viruses which have affected the Internet over the past few weeks."

Perhaps this is a sign that ISPs are at last getting to grips with the problem and that, for Psions, normal service will return.

[netBookBabe]

Originally posted by cshandley There seems to be a pattern that "free" numbers (i.e. unmetered 0800) are far
worse than their "pay and go" numbers (i.e. 0845). I have no idea why that
should be.Neither have I, but it makes a certain amount of sense - I've only accessed on the 0845 number.
Testing the P800 itself, thus ER6/7, would be great.I will do - I had a problem with the P800 yesterday, which blitzed all my settings, so I'll do some testing once I have them restored.

P.S. Julie, missed you today at Epoc Chat :-( Was quite busy though.Nice to be missed! ;) Sorry I didn't manage to get logged in though, but glad it was a lively session.

Julie

[urhs]

I had the same problem recently and a few days ago I looked into the Internet Control Panel (again) to fool around with options. When I thought again about the PPP Extensio checkmark, I opened "Help", found out about the real term PPP-LCP, looked it up at Google and read about implemented time out features, Well, to make it short, turning the PPP Extension off made the problem disappear.

Is that it or is it just a coincidence and the problem will resurface...we'll see!

[voop]

I thought I had searched the archieves before posting, but I just finished posting almost exactly the same question.

I have two psion 5mx'es, one of which is old and my daily workhorse, the second a "virgin" machine kept for backups....

Suddenly, the "workhorse" started to hang up/freeze when connected after a random, and small, amount of time. Never done that before......Ok, I thought I'd f***** up some sw, so I took the virgin machine and tried with thatone. Same result. I can connect, log in and start transfering data -- but after very very little data transfer, the machine freezes. Have to paperclip-in-hole it ;(

Effectively, this removes 90% of the psion's useability for me, since the majority of the apps I use are using the net.

What the heck can have changed? It worked 3 weeks ago flawlessly, now it doesn't work atall ;(

[cshandley]

Originally posted by voop
What the heck can have changed? It worked 3 weeks ago flawlessly, now it
doesn't work atall ;(
If you read this thread, you will see it is nothing you have changed, but rather
that your ISP has changed something.

[cshandley]

I already have PPP turned off, sadly. So I do not think this is the
problem/solution, although it is worth other people trying.

[PhilAP]

Hi Folks,

My PPP extensions have been off from the start but my Psion hangs. :(

Whoever wrote this thing would probably have been sure that this kind of thing wouldn't stop it - though some such people are that thick!

But I would doubt that was a solution anyway. Disabled or enabled, PPP extensions are a common I'Net factor and stopping it that easily would be too easy.

What is true is that my 5mx hangs less often than before, but perhaps Tiscali are really trying to block it. Certainly all ISPs should as there must be many vulnerable Windoze systems out there.

[urhs]

Problem resurfaced. I really hope it is a temporary thing as others suggested and that they are not all changing some software / modems towards something we won't be able to use anymore. I'll be in the US the upcoming weeks, at least at 20 different places with different service providers (I use T-Online International and they're hooked up with dialup roaming partners). So I guess I will have experiences to share,,,

[voop]

I tried both enabeling and disabeling PPP extensions -- same difference, sadly. I've also tried a few ISPs, including free.fr, freesurf.fr, the company-dial-in and now some japanese ISP (I'm visiting Japan). Again, same difference , I get about 2 email headers down before the beast freezes ;(

I'm left considering if I should profit from being in Japan and buy some other pocketable "gadget" running Linux (or any other OS actually supported). Of course, I'll be missing a lot of nice Epoc apps that way, but...;(

SighS, it really suxx. Instead of a 500g Psion PDA as I usually use as travel-companion, I had to travel with a 5 kg laptop this time ;(

[dukibean]

Probably not the root of this problem, but I've noticed that BT's Call Waiting beeps cause my netBook to freeze, irrespective of which ISP I'm connected. Ejecting the modem card resolves the problem.

Regards

[donkeyontheedge]

Watching my 2000 server at home getting battered by worm attacks last night, I was smugly watching my firewall block access to the offenders for 30 minutes. Then I thought, "what if the Psion is doing something to trigger a firewall block at the ISP". This could explain why the system freezes up if all comms to the Psion is suddenly blocked.

I know some ISPs introduced router changers after the last big worm to block ICMP requests etc.

Anyone else think this could be the case?
--
John

[MickKi]

Hi John,Originally posted by donkeyontheedge . . .Then I thought, "what if the Psion is doing something to trigger a firewall block at the ISP". This could explain why the system freezes up if all comms to the Psion is suddenly blocked. I am not an expert on Psion's innards, but think it unlikely that our Psions would freeze under the scenario you describe above. If all the comms are blocked, then Psion would wait for some time and then either time-out, or come up with e.g. a server/connection error. The fact that it freezes means that the processor is asked to process more than it can cope with. A typical buffer overflow behaviour, as Kevin has pointed out in a previous message.

Do we know if Psion know of this problem and are going to do something about the current version of the TCP/IP stack? This problem is screaming for a patch.

Regards,

Mick

[donkeyontheedge]

Just a thought - I do like to always present an alternative view ;)

I can confirm that ejecting the GoldCard does unfreeze the psion. The first time I did this I got a KERN-EXEC in the TCPIP stack, but I didn't think to write down the exact message which may have been helpful in tracing this... damn!
Everytime I've ejected since, I just get prompted to dial-up again.
:(

John

[MickKi]

Hi again,

Any alternative thought that might solve this problem is much appreciated.Originally posted by donkeyontheedge . . . I got a KERN-EXEC in the TCPIP stack, but I didn't think to write down the exact message which may have been helpful in tracing this... damn!
Everytime I've ejected since, I just get prompted to dial-up again. Indeed, the KERN-EXEC error comes up because the processor has conked-out trying to process the long string of code sent by hackers, which causes the buffer overflow (as I understand it). I also get this error on my 5mx.

The other times your Psion is still going, albeit slowly and you run out of patience before the processor does. :D Strictly speaking this is not a crash, just errr, a 'slow down'?

Eventually, the processor will just grind to a halt (crash), or process the code and get on with the next stream. The best fix would be an updated TCP/IP stack and perhaps an EPOC firewall?

Regards,

Mick

[KevinMillican]

A comprehensive list of exploits that might be the cause of Psions freezing is given here :-

http://www.pcflank.com/expl_d.htm

I have seen a few of these in my firewall logs so the threat is real. It should be noted that some of the viruses doing the rounds also use some of these strategies.

[marek]

Since the beginning of September I've been experiencing the problem discussed in this thread.

My initial report had been ignored by the ISP. My second e-mail, sent in the middle of October to one of the company executives, seemingly takes some effect; they have contacted me a couple of days ago and asked me to test my dial-up again. As a result of three test network sessions they have isolated the port that has been attacked. Reportedly, it was only one port (135) -- the same that is used by the worm called Blaster (http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/w32.blaster.worm.html) (originally targeted towards Win 2000/XP machines). I was advised to block the port on the firewall level, but as we all know, no software firewall is available for EPOC. That's why I've asked them to consider filtering the traffic on this troublesome port. I'll post again if the situation progresses.

Since firewalls come in two flavours -- software and hardware -- my Plan B is to hide my netBook behind a hardware Network Address Translator (NAT), which would work as a basic firewall. (I hope a sate of art firewall will not be necessary in our case.) I have located an oldish piece of hardware designed to connect a small LAN to the Internet via the device (http://www.intel.com/support/inbusiness/internetstation/56K/index.htm) build-in modem. (In my case the LAN would consist of one computer only -- my Psion netBook.)

The price of this second hand device was very moderate, so I decided to buy the item and give it a try. It is supposed to be delivered next week. Again, I'll let you know if I make any progress with this box.

[cshandley]

Originally posted by marek
As a result of three test network sessions they have isolated the port that has
been attacked. Reportedly it was only one port (135) -- the same that is used
by the Windows worm called Blaster. I was advised to block the port on the


Thanks for that info. I have added port 135 to my crude firewall (not on Psion
sadly), and will see what it reports.

[cshandley]

Originally posted by cshandley
Thanks for that info. I have added port 135 to my crude firewall (not on Psion
sadly), and will see what it reports.

Bloody hell! 1-3 minutes after I connect, port 135 started getting hammered -
averaging one attempt every 20 seconds! Mostly from a different IP address
every time.

Most tellingly, they ALL come from within my ISP's own network, and are
therefore LOCAL to BTOpenWorld. This may explain why different ISPs have
different scales of the problem, and why unpopular ISPs are generally better for
Psions.

I may have to disable logging of port 135, so that my logs are readable!

BTW, time to nag someone to write a crude firewall in Java, assuming one doesn't
already exist... Well, after some searching, it looks like there aren't any
free ones (that I could find), and it MAY not even be possible in Java; the
closest I got was the following, which needs both Java2 & some non-Java code:

http://netresearch.ics.uci.edu/kfujii/jpcap/doc/index.html

It may be better to get some Symbian C++ expert to knock-together an incredibly
simply "firewall" that just blocks certain ports... So, anyone know such an
expert? :-)

[cangiante]

Ciao Chris,

why don't you ask someone at this forum:

http://www.newlc.com/forums/

[donkeyontheedge]

As to why all the addresses appear internal, it's probably all the idiots out there blindly connecting to the internet without anti-virus or firewall software. They have infected machines looking for new targets...

ISPs should make their users be more responsible, load this stuff on or get refused a connection. That would solve a lot of these problems from the word go.

John

[PhilAP]

Hi,

Originally posted by donkeyontheedge
As to why all the addresses appear internal, it's probably all the idiots out there blindly connecting to the internet without anti-virus or firewall software. They have infected machines looking for new targets...

ISPs should make their users be more responsible, load this stuff on or get refused a connection. That would solve a lot of these problems from the word go.

I'm not sure that anyone can make anyone do anything - but arguing doesn't help anyway. And it wouldn't solve this problem either.

I know that IT savvy folk can and do protect their machines but ISPs advertise that they'll do this job and customers need know nothing about it. "You use the machine and let us take care of the technicalities".

Virus writers will release viruses and this virus affects EPOC machines that can't be (and consequently haven't been) infected by it. There is no EPOC firewall and now we only need one to block a badly written (!) virus from tying up our I'Net connections.

My ISP, Tiscali, has been told as much as has been written here. My machines (not all Psions) are protected where possible and none are infected. But I use my 5mx for eMail and I still have trouble. If Tiscali block this virus, and they well might if they can, then so should all other responsible ISPs.

[hlub]

I made a small java program that may be a solution to the "freezing when online" problem. It is currenlly very crude and not really easy to use. I won't work on it until I know whether it really works.

You can find it here (http://utopia.knoware.nl/~hlub/uck/rlwrap/Sink.zip)

I would be grateful if someone who

still has the problem
knows how to start java programs from psions ESHELL


would try it out and see if it really works. I'm still a bit skeptical about this myself.


I used the program myself when on tour in France, and my psion didn't freeze.I didn't try what would happen without is because mobile phoning is expensive abroad. Now, back in Holland, I don't have the freezing problem even without the java program, probably because their filters work better now.

All the program does is accepting connections on port 135 and immediately closing them again.


Hans

[Simon Chadwick]

What a hero, despite never having done such things before I managed to get the Sink programme running and subsequently get online via both psions without any problems. And yes to test it I closed the Sink and the psion froze within minutes. So from this limited perspective it does indeed seem to solve the problem...

[KevinMillican]

I have been running security scans using various ISPs with my netBook and Gold Card Modem.

Interestingly, UK2 (for whom there isn't even any signup required - see http://adial.co.uk/ ) actually block some of these ports automatically. It delays the freeze but doesn't eliminate the problem.

Locking port 135 on its own is insufficient; you would need to block at least the following :-

epmap 135
ms-sql-m 1434
netbios-ns 137
ms-sql-s 1433
--- 27347
microsoft-ds 445
ftp 21
www 80
netbios-ssn 139
SubSeven 27374

(These are currently the most-attacked ports).

I can also confirm that when the machine freezes, flicking out the Gold Card always releases it immediately.

I have now written to Psion on behalf of the wider EPOC community asking them whether they intend to respond to this problem - thereby living up to their published statement to continue supporting these devices until December 2004.

I have also written to Teklogix on a similar vein specifically regarding the netBook.

I will let you know the outcome.

[donkeyontheedge]

I don't know if this is going to be any use, but I came across it only in the last day or two (even though the site hasn't been updated for a few years).

http://www.starship.freeserve.co.uk/opl.html

It's a WebServer written in OPL. It looks for Port80 and sends the Psion filesystem, allowing you to browse the contents of your Psion from a remote machine.

Source code is included, so perhaps it could be used as a basis for a firewall? Just automatically listening for certain ports and then closing them would be enough. Should be able to write something so that the port numbers can be gained from an external file, allowing simple future updates??

Being OPL, it should be faster than a JAVA version. I just don't know if it would work or not... Any takers?
I'm writing to the author as well just in case he fancies taking up the challenge.

John

[KevinMillican]

I don't know if this is going to be any use, but I came across it only in the last day or two (even though the site hasn't been updated for a few years).
Being OPL, it should be faster than a JAVA version. I just don't know if it would work or not... Any takers?

Already tried it. Actually the webserver itself won't translate on the netBook exactly as supplied - a few mods were required.

I did manage to exploit a bug in the program that causes it to forget to respond, effectively blocking the required port. It can be made to work on any port but I haven't found a way of using it to block more than one at the same time. Also, to be effective it needs to be live and able to change the IP address it listens to in order to 'NOT Respond' - again, difficult to do unless the port is actually open - which defeats the object.

[urhs]

I did not find information how to start Java. The following doesn't seem to work (sink.class in root of c:\):

Java -cp c:\ Sink

Or does it just not like SmtpAuth to run at the same time?

[hlub]

The following doesn't seem to work (sink.class in root of c:\):

Java -cp c:\ Sink

I am sorry that I forgot to mention/didn't know a few things right away:

Sink is so simplistic that it uses a console window for its output. Epoc Java only opens a console if


a file ?:\System\Java\console exists (may be empty)
the directory ?:\Logs\Java does not exist


... where ? may be either C or D.

If those two conditions are not met, java won't open a console window, and then only a soft reset can terminate the program [as I discovered today :mad: ...]

[MickKi]

Hi,

Not directly relevant to the thread, but the Symbian website provides JavaSweep (http://www.symbian.com/developer/downloads/files/JavaSweep.zip), which closes any rogue Java applications. ;)

To see if there are any orphaned Java Runtime processes running in the background, start up Eshell.exe and type ps. You'll see these listed as "Javarun".

Running JavaSweep (sweeper.exe) will close them gracefully.

Regards,

Mick

[PhilAP]

Hi,

hlub's Java program seems to work, albeit unreliably (no criticism - if I produced a program that worked as well I'd be delirious).

That proves one very important thing - this problem can be solved, whether by Psion or by one of us (one vastly more capable than I).

Obviously the problem should be addressed by the relevant ISPs as it has been in other countries - but it seems that my ISP (amongst others) will not even admit a problem exists. I assume this is actually using their resources as well as infecting Windoze machines and locking my Psion.

It should also be looked at by Psion as it is their machines (and their reputation) that are affected but this is not altogether their responsibilty. If they do produce a solution it should not be limited to this if at all possible.

But we're getting somewhere!

[cshandley]

Hi Kevin,

While I agree handling other ports than 135 may be necessary, port 135 is by far
the most important; compared to port 27374, port 135 gets attempts 30 times as
often (i.e. every 10 minutes, compared to every 20 seconds). Other ports get
attacked even less often than 27374.

Also, it is not clear whether all worms cause problems with Psions, or if it is
only the port135-using worms that trip-up EPOC's kernel. Certainly the sudden
wave of problems with Psions suggest that port135 may be the only issue.

OTOH, I have very occasionally had freezes using the internet on my Psion
before, but I had put this down to Opera. But maybe it is down to other worms
which just attack less often (as they are less virulent).
---
Chris Handley

Originally posted by KevinMillican
Locking port 135 on its own is insufficient; you would need to block at least
the following :-

epmap 135
ms-sql-m 1434
netbios-ns 137
ms-sql-s 1433
--- 27347
microsoft-ds 445
ftp 21
www 80
netbios-ssn 139
SubSeven 27374

(These are currently the most-attacked ports).

[cshandley]

To Everyone:

I have attached a ZIP of an OPL program which will run Sink for you. It should
be put in the same folder as Sink, and is run by opening the RunSink.opo file.

It can be easily made to run other Java programs, without any need to resort to
EShell.


To Hans:

Thanks for your little program. Unfortunately, after a quick try, it did not
seem to solve my freeze problem. Maybe thats just because it needs to block
27374 too, maybe not.

Regards,
Chris Handley

Originally posted by hlub
I made a small java program that may be a solution to the "freezing when
online" problem. It is currenlly very crude and not really
easy to use. I won't work on it until I know whether it really works.

[jdunn]

Pleased to know I,m not alone.
Virgin freezes but so far Freeserve does not (at least long enough to get emails).

[MickKi]

Originally posted by cshandley
. . . Also, it is not clear whether all worms cause problems with Psions, or if it is
only the port135-using worms that trip-up EPOC's kernel. Certainly the sudden
wave of problems with Psions suggest that port135 may be the only issue. I suspect that it is primarily these which cause a buffer overflow that bring our little processors to a grinding halt. Other types of attack, invariably tailored for windoze, do not affect EPOC's kernel.
Originally posted by cshandley
. . . OTOH, I have very occasionally had freezes using the internet on my Psion before, but I had put this down to Opera. But maybe it is down to other worms which just attack less often (as they are less virulent). Yes, same here. I can confirm that on rare occasions I have had freezes with Email, Opera 5.14 and Web. While the Psion was frozen up I could see the lights of the modem (send & receive) flickering like mad. Let's hope Psion take action in updating the TCP/IP because an EPOC firewall would perhaps be an overkill?

Regards,

Mick

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by cshandley
While I agree handling other ports than 135 may be necessary, port 135 is by far the most important...
Analysis of my firewall logs shows that port 137 is just as popular as 135.

Together these account for about 70% of the port scan attempts.

Like you, I did not find that Sink solved the problem - I think you would need to block these main two, plus a few other sub-1024 ones.

[KevinMillican]

"From: uk.support@uk.teklogix.com
Subject : RE: netBook Freezes when Connecting to Internet

Kevin,

As the Netbook is discontinued to make way for the Netbook Pro (WinCE), we are not aware that any more work is being done to improve the connectivity of the old Netbook, although the problems that you describe we have not come across before.

Regards

UK.Support"
I'm hoping for a slightly more encouraging response from Psion Digital

[Craggy]

I've just finished this long thread.

I don't use my netBook a lot since leaving Psion. When I do it tends to be using 802.11 to connect to my home network for internet.
I still get frequent freezes using this, despite the fact that I have a working firewall in my ADSL router. I'm still going to give the port blocker a try.

WRT Psion making a change to the TCP/IP stack... don't hold your breath. They do not have many developers left working on EPOC.

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by Craggy
I don't use my netBook a lot since leaving Psion. When I do it tends to be using 802.11 to connect to my home network for internet.
I still get frequent freezes using this, despite the fact that I have a working firewall in my ADSL router.
Nearly all my internet connections from my netBook are WiFi and I have never experienced the freezing problem when connected this way.

Of course - I have had occasional lock-ups using Opera (who hasn't ?!) but these are quite distinct and usually result from accessing specific web pages that give it problems. An Opera crash can only be recovered by soft-reset, whereas the freezing problem disappears as soon as the PCMCIA card is flicked out.

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by Craggy
WRT Psion making a change to the TCP/IP stack... don't hold your breath. They do not have many developers left working on EPOC.

Well I am expecting them to be at least helpful; Psion are still selling Revos and netBooks through their Expansys 'Psion Store'.
They also committed themselves to supporting existing products up until December 2004.

IMHO there's more to 'support' than offering a premium rate telephone help number. I have supported Psion by buying their products since the 3c; there would be no Psion or Symbian if it were not for thousands of users and enthusiasts like me.

I fully expect them to honour their commitment.

[cshandley]

Since the problem (seems) to also happen on the Epoc Emulator, it should be very easy for someone in-the-know to locate the bug. And I expect a fix or kludge should be fairly easy to.

[Craggy]

Quite right too. But I'm just trying to be realistic.
Companies do what they think is good for them at the time. Psion have moved away from EPOC and consumer models, so they are not gaining much in keeping the userbase sweet.

Having said that, there are a few UK employees still, so they may do something.

[Craggy]

Originally posted by KevinMillican

Of course - I have had occasional lock-ups using Opera (who hasn't ?!) <snip> An Opera crash can only be recovered by soft-reset, whereas the freezing problem disappears as soon as the PCMCIA card is flicked out.
Opera was what I was blaming already (damned unfinished rubbish... mumble something about product management) . I haven't tried anything else yet. It may be that my problems are totally related to Opera. I'll try flicking out the WLAN card next time to see what happens. :rolleyes:

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by Craggy
Quite right too. But I'm just trying to be realistic.
Companies do what they think is good for them at the time. Psion have moved away from EPOC and consumer models, so they are not gaining much in keeping the userbase sweet. Oh I agree; any company's first responsibility (HS&E aside) is to its profitability.

What we need here is a bit of synergy between the technical and marketing departments. After all, which headline do you think Psion would rather see on Bill Thompson's BBC Website column:
* "Psion leaves thousands of loyal users in the lurch as internet becomes more hostile...", or
* "Psion leaps to the rescue of its loyal userbase..."

I'm sure they are weighing the costs/benefits of both approaches ;)

[netBookBabe]

Originally posted by KevinMillican
I'm sure they are weighing the costs/benefits of both approaches ;) I admire your faith, Kevin! (Oh, and yes, I did note the wink attached to your comment.)

Julie

[cshandley]

Hello all,

I've just noticed I made a mistake in interpreting my evidence, which actually
helps confirm the "Worm theory". I had thought that my 0845 number was
less freeze-prone than my 0800 number, but in the last week the 0845 number
became unusable too. I now realise my mistake:

In fact, it is the time of day that determines the likely-hood of
freezes, and this last week I have changed what time I check for email!

It seems that any time from say 10/11am to afternoon/evening is bad for freezes,
while 8-9am gives me very few. I suspect that late-at-night times will also be
good.

This is exactly what I should expect, if the freezes are due to worm attacks
from other computers on my own ISP. I had already observed that (for some
reason) such attacks all originate within my ISP, therefore limiting the
attackers to the country I live in (same time zone). Most computers will be
switched-on & connected to the internet during the day, hence most infected
computers will be too.

---
Chris Handley

[MickKi]

I would similarly assume that the more users are online the worse the problem would be. I have also managed to download/send emails late at night and was surprised that my Psion did not freeze. During busy times the problem was back again.

What I can't understand is how can these darn worms persist, after all the Windows Updates and firewall/antivirus patches? Surely, most (all?) windoze machines must be patched by now.

Regards,

Mick

PS. My Norton AV/Firewall on my Windoze XP PC is about to expire. Any advice on alternatives - or shall I stick to Norton?

[cshandley]

Originally posted by MickKi
What I can't understand is how can these darn worms persist, after all the
Windows Updates and firewall/antivirus patches? Surely, most (all?) windoze
machines must be patched by now.

Easy, I think: The Windows patch only stops it from being vunerable to port
attacks, it doesn't get rid of the worm itself! Hence, for the X million
machines infected, all of them need to be virus checked before they stop trying
to make attacks :-((((

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by MickKi
PS. My Norton AV/Firewall on my Windoze XP PC is about to expire. Any advice on alternatives - or shall I stick to Norton?

Personally, I find EZ Antivirus brilliant value for money and has a lower overhead than most others :-

http://www.my-etrust.com

Those people who can't afford/won't buy should look at this free antivirus solution :-

http://www.free-av.com

It works well even on older PCs.

As to firewall, the XP built-in firewall is sufficient provided you know what's running on your machine (usually taken care of by your antivirus software). If you need program control as well, then ZoneAlarm is hard to beat. However, Sygate's Personal Firewall is also very powerful, if a little 'techie':-

http://smb.sygate.com/free/default.php

If you ever suspect something else might be using your internet connection, you should run the command line and enter 'netstat' or 'netstat -a'. It is well worth becoming familiar with its output.

[netBookBabe]

Originally posted by KevinMillican
Personally, I find EZ Antivirus brilliant value for money and has a lower overhead than most others...
Thanks for the recommendation Kevin. My new laptop came with Norton AV, but only a 90-day subscription, so I'll need to decide soon what to do. Might give EZ a try then!

Julie

[MickKi]

I have been using AVG Free Edition (http://www.grisoft.com/us/us_dwnl_free.php) and the Sygate Free Firewall on my (NT4) laptop without any problem. The thing is that I prefer Norton, blocking Java and Active-X scripts until I allow these to run. Does the Sygate Pro similarly control Java & Active-X?

Regards,

Mick

[KevinMillican]

Originally posted by MickKi
The thing is that I prefer Norton, blocking Java and Active-X scripts until I allow these to run. Does the Sygate Pro similarly control Java & Active-X?

I'm not sure. However, Internet Explorer allows you to define these rules in the 'Security' section of 'Internet Options".

[MickKi]

Hi Kevin,Originally posted by KevinMillican
I'm not sure. However, Internet Explorer allows you to define these rules in the 'Security' section of 'Internet Options". I humbly suggest that the use of the word 'Security' with M$ Internet Explorer, Outlook/Express, etc. is an oxymoron ;) but I know what you're referring to. I mostly use Opera 7.21, Build 3218, as a browser which although it offers the option to switch off Java altogether, it doesn't prompt during browsing. It is a much better and faster product than IE and although its M2 email client is an acquired taste, it is quite a few versions more developed than our EPOC 5.14. I better stop now, before I have a go at them for not finishing off the 5.14 development :mad:

Regards,

Mick

[PhilAP]

Hi,

Some ISPs take this (multiple) threat seriously enough to block it in various ways.

Unfortunately some others, including mine (Tiscali), have no intention of blocking it as they feel that it is solely the responsibility of those users who are infected. Apparently such users should all be totally savvy about any and all viruses and trojans :eek: .

But since a lot of those users are, by definition, ignorant of their infection this means that Psion users (uninfected) on such networks need either firewalls or another ISP. If you haven't got a firewall - tough :( .

To me it is astonishing (but not surprising) that any InterNet Service Providers should refuse to Provide Service to customers' InterNet connections but that seems to be the case. I mean, aren't these viruses using the ISPs facilities and actually using them quite intensively enough for it to be in the ISPs interest to block them anyway :confused: ?

Many more responsible ISPs don't assume that users should always take responsibility for other users over whom they have little, often no, influence and no control. If anyone can recommend an appropriate (24/7) ISP I'd be interested and I'd bet others would be too :D .

[MikeMcC]

Phil,
If anyone can recommend an appropriate (24/7) ISP I'd be interested and I'd bet others would be too To the best of my knowledge, connections using Claranet (http://www.clara.net) have not caused the Psion to freeze. They have a 24/7 package but initially you can give them a try on a pay-as-you-go basis. Claranet host the FreeUK (http://www.freeuk.com) service which also seems to be protected with "anti-freeze" :)

[netBookBabe]

Originally posted by MikeMcC
Claranet host the FreeUK (http://www.freeuk.com) service which also seems to be protected with "anti-freeze" :) Nicely coined phrase, Mike! :)

Phil, I use PlusNet and have not thus far experienced the "freeze":

http://www.plus.net/

They too have a pay-as-you-go number, as well as several different unmetered options. A bonus I like is that they permit up to five landline numbers to be nominated on an unmetered package, which you can change at will. Extremely useful if you wish to use your connection at various locations.

Julie

[MickKi]

Hi,
Originally posted by PhilAP
If anyone can recommend an appropriate (24/7) ISP I'd be interested and I'd bet others would be too :D . On this same theme, I think I have mentioned elsewhere in this rather long thread that BBinternet (http://www.bbinternet.net) offer a pay-as-you-go dialup service with webmail/POP3/free webspace and a 50:1 contention rate, which so far has not given me any problems.

If you only want internet access, without their email account, you could just use the phone No. and username/password at the bottom of their page without even registering.

But, please promise that you won't be using it to connect to the internet with an infected PC! :p

Regards,

Mick

[hlub]

Using a network packet generator and a bit of patience, I have found that:

- when using a modem, any connection attempt to a closed port will freeze the psion. No special nasty SYN packets are needed for that

- when the psion is listening to the port, the freezing doesn't occur

- when using a direct ppp link, no freezes ever happen, so it is not a problem in just the TCP/IP stack.

Because of the last point, investigating the problem costs money (needs to use a mobile phone), and I have not put too much time in it.

I have extended my little java program Sink (http://utopia.knoware.nl/~hlub/uck/rlwrap/Sink.zip) to listen to the most often attacked ports

It is still a bit awkward to use (you have to start it from ESHELL) and I am still not 100% certain about its effectiveness.

But for me it works.

Hans

[MickKi]

Hi Hans,

Please excuse my ignorance, but I cannot understand everything you're saying:Originally posted by hlub
...- when using a modem, any connection attempt to a closed port will freeze the psion. No special nasty SYN packets are needed for that I don't understand this behaviour - shouldn't it just return an error?

- when the psion is listening to the port, the freezing doesn't occur Or is it that because the Psion is not frozen, it is therefore listening to the port?

- when using a direct ppp link, no freezes ever happen, so it is not a problem in just the TCP/IP stack. It could still be a problem with the TCP/IP stack, when the connection does not use PPP. The PPP provides all the negotiation configuration at the beginning - after that it is the same like SLIP (albeit with a multi-protocol ability). Could it be that with PPP a more robust connection is established, thereafter less susceptible to connection problems? Notwithstanding this, some users have reported problems with, or without PPP being enabled.

Regards,

Mick

[cshandley]

Hans,

Originally posted by hlub
It is still a bit awkward to use (you have to start it from ESHELL) and I am
still not 100% certain about its effectiveness.

Done! Please find attached a ZIP containing an SIS for installing Sink on the
Extras bar :-)

If you would like to take-over compilation of the SIS (to contain updated Java
code), I can send you the PKG file (and folder structure) that I used.

BTW, I did this because Sink now *seems* to work for me :-) . Thanks in
advance, but I will still keep testing to be 100 percent sure!

Regards,
Chris Handley

[hlub]

If you would like to take-over compilation of the SIS (to contain updated Java
code), I can send you the PKG file (and folder structure) that I used.

Yes, please. There are a few little things I would like to add to the program (like an easy way to configure the ports it listens to) when I get the time for that. Re-using your SIS setup means that people can simply re-install the .sis file in order to update.

I get the impression that Sink works for most people. I am glad about that, though I would have preferred a real fix (Sink doesn't fix the bug, it only makes its occurrence much less likely)

Moreover, one will have to update the list of ports it listens to whenever some new worm or virus appears, as there is no way to listen to all 65536 TCP ports simultaneously.

All this is a bit unsatisfactory, but I see no other solution at this moment.

Hans.

[cshandley]

Hans:
Please send me a PM with your email address, I will email you the files as a ZIP.

EVERYONE:
Thanks to a PM from Simon Chadwick, I noticed that my Sink launcher needs the latest Sysram1.sis OPX file, but that it is not automatically installed.

The attached SIS file now installs it for you, and also has additional error reporting.


BTW, anybody feel up to making a *decent* icon? Mine really sucks! :)

BTW #2, a technical issue with my SIS is that it uses a *development* UID that should really not be used by the public. Really someone needs to register a UID with Symbian...
---
Chris Handley

[hughlook]

I've installed Chris Handley's version of Sink, but not quite sure what the sequence for using it should be.

When I open it, it gives me the internet connections dialogue. Should I go ahead & establish a connection, & then open the email app, or open the mail app & then the connection? Both seem OK - perhaps it doesn't matter.

Similarly, closing down - should I disconnect via the email app menu first & then close Sink, or again, does this not matter?

Thanks, and thanks to Hans & Chris as well.

Hugh

[PhilAP]

Hi,

Sink seems to work perfectly for me.

I just leave it running as it doesn't seem to use up any resources. Mostly I use it with the eMail application as I use my Mac usuallly for the 'Net. With the SIS installation it seems straightforward to use, just run it, but I did use the previous installation.

I just followed the instructions in both cases, the only difficulty being that the Eshell command line was case-sensitive and I couldn't cut'n'pate it!

But the application installation is straightforward and, though Chris might not like his icon, it suits me fine. I'm truly grateful that Hans and Chris have written this as it has made my Psion usable on the 'Net again. I may not use it very often but I do use it regularly and since my 5mx is my main machine nearly all it's functions are important to me anyway.

When the application is finalised I suggest it be uploaded to both PsionPlace and TUCOWS (as well as Freepoc, of course).

Again, thank you, Hans and Chris both.

[MickKi]

Hans and Chris,

All of us Psion users owe you a big thank you for your valuable efforts in providing us with this temporary fix.

I just hope that M$ get their bloatware sorted :p ; that hackers get a job (or a life) and leave windoze and Psion users alone; and ahem, . . . Psion do sort out the TCP/IP stack to cope with the demands of what is fast becoming "a jungle out there" :rolleyes:

Kind regards,

Mick

PS. Port 135 is MSBlaster allright, but there's a loooong list (http://lists.gpick.com/portlist/portlist.htm) of others little monsters waiting to get in :D Not sure why Psions are only affected from these few ports though? :confused: Any ideas?

[cshandley]

Here's how I found best to use Sink:

Use Sink to start my first interenet connection. But when I am finished with the Internet, use Email/etc to close the internet connection - AND LEAVE SINK RUNNING!

Unless you are unlucky, Sink will NOT report it's ports were forecfully closed, and therefore the next time you connect to the internet normally (i.e. through Email/etc) you will find Sink starts working automatically.

---
Chris Handley

P.S. Thanks for the praise, although of course I mainly wrote the program for myself (as with all my programs really:-)

[mvcube]

Hi,

as you probably know, I've created the Java app SmtpAuth as a tool to help using EPOC mail with ISPs requiring SMTP authentication.

It might be a good idea to add the "Sink" functions as part of SmtpAuth for those who need to run both programs. This should keep the memory footprint smaller than running both Java apps the same time.

Please let me know your opinion(s).

SmtpAuth: http://www.mvcsys.de/doc/smtpauth.html

[PhilAP]

Hi Marcus,

I haven't needed SmtpAuth yet as my ISP doesn't need SMTP authentication yet :) (yet may be the operative word here for many). But it seems that that is a likely scenario for many so . . . why not?

Also there are almost certainly some people who could use it today.

I think there is a way of having only one JVM running several Java programs but I don't know what it is and most people won't want to be bothered - they neither need nor want Java normally. So to combine the two utilities they may well want makes sense, to me anyway.

[urhs]

SMTPauth will be an absolute requirement very soon since less and less Providers will accept incoming non-auth Emails. Mine just has closed this service to avoid that e.g. AOL refuses some mails coming from 1&1.

I think the idea of a "fix internet stuff program" is great, I would suggest to inlcude it in a control panel though to make it more handy. AtomicTime could be a great base for that. What do you think?

Meanwhile: Thanks for providing SMTPauth and Sink!!!

Contacts for AtomicTime:
robin_hood@hotmail.ru
mypsion.ru/atomictime.php

[cangiante]

I have been using SMTPauth since the very start and found it great.

I am downloading Sink now and I think I am going to use it as much as SMTPauth. Surely I would love to have both Sink and SMTPauth in the same context, as long as nobody is bothered for this unification.

thanks to Chris, Hlub, Marcus and everybody who is keeping on developing programs and apps for the ER5 machines;)

all the very best

[mvcube]

Done!

Check out http://www.mvcsys.de/doc/smtpauth.html

[hlub]

I think Marcus' incorporating Sink into SmtpAuth is an excellent idea!

For those of you who don't have a lot of memory, there now is an OPL version of Sink, which uses much less memory than Java programs like SmtpAuth or the original Sink (this only matters when you can do without SmtpAuth, of course)

It comes with a little help file and is easily configurable. It can be found here (http://utopia.knoware.nl/~hlub/uck/rlwrap/Sink2.zip)

Hans

[urhs]

Could SMTPauth also be incomporated into a Sink OPL? Or control panel? Is -besides the memory issue- a Java program slower than OPL? I sometimes have the impression sending Mails via SMTPauth takes quite a while but I may be wrong...

Anyway: thanks to all of you for helping us staying connected!!!!!

[mvcube]

Hi uhrs,

(komischer Name!)

SmtpAuth makes havy use of multithreading and networking. This is handled exceptionally good by Java. I cannot tell how good OPL is at this, but I feel I'd have some problems implementing SmtpAuth this way.

Whether some code is an application or a control panel icon doesn't make much difference, memory wise.

In order to keep SmtpAuth really small and highly performant I will have to rewrite it in C++; but this is a mayor step I'd like to postpone until neccessary.

[urhs]

komischer name - indeed. lack of fantasy, so i used my initials.

again: i am extremely grateful for what we have now.

what i like about the control panel idea: atomictime (mentioned earlier) is just there. It doesn't need to be started or ended, still it is configurable. i just thought that a "internet extras & bugfixes" control panel would make it more convenient. it would also make sure you don't forget to start this and that.

schöne grüße aus berlin
uwe

[mvcube]

Uwe,

I don't know atomic time, so I can't tell you what it does and when it is active.

The syoftware we are talking about must be started at some point because it is an active component. This start can be made invisible to the user, but since the software needs resources, it's not wise to let it run all the time when it's not needed. Thus, a seperate and explicit startup sequence is a practical way.

[urhs]

I see. I know, owning an Amiga, the resources point is important. As with my netBook, I bought it shortly before they stopped developping it. And as with my netBook, it needs more and more patches and extra programs to keep it follow the demands of our time. The words "startup sequence" reminded me of this fact...

I don't know how AtomicTime does it, but it is very handy and does not need any attention. It realizes when you are online and ajusts the Psion to a time server.

So, being an ignorant non-programmer, I thought this is the way bug fixes & other add-ons could be implemented, too, perhaps in a modular way, so certain functions could go active when online and inactive when offline to save resources.

Again, I don't know anything about programming and just wanted to suggest something.

Thanks again - it works really well the way it is.

Uwe

[cshandley]

Originally posted by urhs
So, being an ignorant non-programmer, I thought this is the way bug fixes &
other add-ons could be implemented, too, perhaps in a modular way, so certain
functions could go active when online and inactive when offline to save
resources.

Being an ignorant programmer :) I think your way makes a lot of sense for bug
fixes & the like. But of course, I didn't write any of those programs, so it's
not up to me to decide.

Anyone have any idea HOW Atomic Clock does it's start-up magic? Does it need
C++ code? That would rule-out both current Java/OPL apps.

[cangiante]

Ciao all!

I know that 99% of us know well Atomic time but, just for the 1% which probably do not;), Atomic time was created by the mythical russian programmer known as Robin Hood:
http://www.mypsion.ru/atomictime.php

you can even write him at the following address, if you like:
robin_hood AT hotmail DOT ru

Robin speaks very good english and is the author also of the following apps:

alarm plus
http://www.mypsion.ru/alarmplus.php

reset plus
http://www.mypsion.ru/resetplus.php

quote my mail
http://www.mypsion.ru/qmm.php

and, among the many others, here is the latest one:

http://www.mypsion.ru/zexe.php

should anybody contact him, PLS send my personal ciao to him

[mvcube]

Hi,

AtomicTime does not autostart itself:

"Is is highly recommended to use AlarmPlus' autorun feature to run Atomic Time server after soft reset."

[urhs]

I know but from then on it autodetects online to adjust time following your preferences.

I assume you want to suggest, that this is a system patch and that all resources for smtpauth & sink, if realized that way, would need to be there all the time, thus using up too much for people with limited memory?

Well, right, but what about just using Atimes autodetection hook to start smtpauth & sink when going online? It seems to be a flag preferable to the "I am online" flag of the built-in TCP since it doesn't prevent auto-going-offline when closing the last internet app. Sink & SmtpAuth though do since they're are real apps and so you always need to make sure that you go offline.

But again, all these are minor things, and perhaps we should'nt bother too much with it. I am using the internet now like before the worms and hey - what also would I ask for!

Thanks
Uwe

[Spuddey]

Has anyone seen this or tried it yet?

'For what is worth, there is a TCP/IP stack update for ER5 that will help to resolve some of the lockup issues encounter when trying to access Internet. Rename the attached file to .sis and run it on your machine.

Attachment: tcpip_up.txt
This has been downloaded 3 time(s).'

See post at http://www.pdastreet.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=129237#post129237 (http://www.pdastreet.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=129237#post129237) for the file this message refers to - MikeMcC

[AlexL]

Here you go, as it's the season of good will and all that, here are three SIS files containing the updated TCP/IP stack, with the fix I have implemented.

Series 5mx, Revo/Revo+, Series 7, netBook < Build 158 All without Ethernet use the following:
TCPIP_UPDATE(Non-Ethernet).SIS

netBook build(s) 158, netPad (or Series 7, netBook <158 with Ethernet installed in RAM) use:
TCPIP_UPDATE(Ethernet).SIS

Series 5mx, Revo/Revo+, Series 7, netBook < 158 IrLAN drivers:
IrLan.SIS


Note: ONLY USE ONE OF THE SIS FILES !

Always backup your device BEFORE installing anything, including this Update !
No warranty provided, use at your own risk.

http://members.fortunecity.co.uk/alexl/dload/ER5-TCPIP-Update.zip

Alex, PT.

[Global]

Thank you very much, Alex. But there is something I don't understand. With a 7book sometimes I use ethernet/LAN and sometimes an infrared connection to a GSM phone. So which update should I use?
Global

[MickKi]

THANK YOU ALEX!

Fantastic news, it seems that the patch works without any problems on a Psion 5mx with a 56K US Robotic modem (will try the mobile later). :)

Two questions please:[list=a]
I didn't know that the 5mx can connect to a LAN (since it doesn't have an ethernet card). What is the irLAN driver then? Could a hardware setup with this driver also be used for a Wi-Fi connection? Any links and, or instructions would be appreciated.
How did you do it? How does the patch deal with the malformed datagrams? (just curious ;) )
[/list=a]
Kind regards,

Mick

[cangiante]

Originally posted by AlexL


http://members.fortunecity.co.uk/alexl/dload/ER5-TCPIP-Update.zip

Alex, PT.

Thanks very much Alex for your posting here, it turns out to be a very much appreciated Christmas present.

I have a question for you, since I had renamed my tcpip.prt file into a more neutral (and inoffensive) TCPIPPRT .

The fact was that I was facing problems in switching back and forth between a wireless lan connection and a gprs one and here at psionplace I was given the above-mentioned hint, which turned out to be successful.

what do you think, by installing the tcpip update I will be having similar problems in switching back and forth between wifi and gprs?

I have just performed a backup and I will be trying soon the tcpip update anyway . BTW any suggestion will be very gratefully received;)

[PhilAP]

Hi,

I know the Psion patch works for most but it didn't for me.

I just installed it from the SIS file, stopped Sink2 loading and reset my 5mx. When it had rebooted I tried Email first. The connection failed immediately (no connection at all). Ditto wth Web and Opera.

So I removed it, reloaded Sink2 and everything worked again.

Somehow the patch actually stopped my I'Net connection before it even addressed the modem. I know some programs seem to dislike the extra RAM (8MB courtesy D&G) and that the extra RAM is considerably more than the extra that Sink uses.

So although I don't mind using Sink2 (for which I still thank Hans), I think PT should be told. I might be the only person affected but I doubt it.

[MickKi]

Hi Phil,

Originally posted by PhilAP
When it had rebooted I tried Email first. The connection failed immediately (no connection at all). Ditto wth Web and Opera. The same happened with my Psion 5mx, when I installed the first TCP/IP patch from here: http://tinyurl.com/332ox
Somehow the patch actually stopped my I'Net connection before it even addressed the modem. I know some programs seem to dislike the extra RAM (8MB courtesy D&G) and that the extra RAM is considerably more than the extra that Sink uses. The error I got was something about the loader not working (duh! I know I should have written it down ;) ) However, downloading and installing the TCPIP_UPDATE(Non-Ethernet).SIS from above, worked first time. Something you may need to consider is stopping (or even temporarily uninstalling) any application which is using the existing TCP/IP stack e.g. Atomic Time, and performing a soft reset to make sure that all threads are dropped. I unistalled both Atomic Time and AlarmPlus to be on the safe side and did not have any problems thereafter. Of course, once the new patch is installed you can reinstall these apps which work fine with the new patch :)

Good luck,

Mick

[cangiante]

... what do you think, by installing the tcpip update I will be having similar problems in switching back and forth between wifi and gprs?
...
I have just performed a backup and I will be trying soon the tcpip update anyway...

I installed the (ethernet) update and until now everything goes fine.

I have already tried connecting to the internet a few times now.
firstly via a Wireless lan PCMCIA card, then via infrared through my
GPRS t68i, than back to the WI-FI card and back again to the GPRS Option globetrotter PCMCIA card.
Lastly, here I am back to the wi-fi connection... no problem in switching back and forth between the two options... everything seems OK

could it be that using Sink2 in combination with the TcpIp update we might maximize the results?

[PhilAP]

Hi,

I tried unloading first Alarm+ and Atomic Time - different failure code but the same result - immediately the machine says no code and the application says it is not connected.

Unloading the patch (and that's all) restores the status quo - the connection connects and Sink works. I tried several other ways, including unloadins (or uninstalling) any and all Robin Hood/King Midas applications (really just Reset+) - still no go and the same restore works!

Anyone got any ideas?

(I'm not worried, just intrigued.)

[Global]

Postings on this site from earlier today, 22 December appear to have disappeared as a result of a crash. I wanted to let AlexL know that I read his posting before it vanished and appreciate very much his having let me and others know which SIS file to install.
Global

[PhilAP]

Hi Folks,

I want to thank Psion, and Alex in particular, for their help - also everybody else who has helped or even tried to help.

Psion had no real legal obligation to help but did anyway - that's wonderful.

Happy Hogmanay to all!

[AlexL]

Recovered from cache:
Posting by : MickKi 12-22-2003 06:47 AM
What's the error code?
Hi Phil,

Could you please tell us what's the error code exactly?

Perhaps Alex, or others could then advise what may be causing it. All I can suggest from my limited experience with this patch is what I have already said above, that all previous threads from applications to the TCP/IP need to be dropped before the patch is installed.

Good luck,

Mike


Recovered from cache:
Posting by : PhilAP 12-22-2003 09:33 AM

:cool: It's like magic!
Hi MickKi,

To take advantage of your kind offer I reinstalled the patch after stopping Sink but not uninstalling (or stopping) the Robin Hood/King Midas programs.

It seems to work now.

I'll report if it fails again, but if I have to use Sink I really don't mind.

But I still don't understand why some (most?) ISPs seem happy for the viruses (or whatever) to use their facilities. The cost in purely electronic terms must be more than negligible, probably more than the cost of blocking them!

And the moral and commercial cost is greater still.

TANJ!


__________________
Happy Days,
Phil.

"Don't worry, don't hurry -
and don't forget to smell the flowers."



Recovered from cache:
Posting by : PhilAP 12-22-2003 10:50 AM

:mad: Magic - !#*@ing magic!
Hi,

When posting my previous missive the Psion first dropped the I'Net connection though the modem stayed connected. Then it locked requiring a reset.

I then tried to connect again using Email. Within seconds the alert
"SocketServer
LDR- IMPORT
Reason number 2"
appeared. Under it another alert said
"Server has closed".

The former is not the original alert but the latter has alway appeared when the connection was not made.

So back to Sink!

Incidentally I have to uninstall the patch for any I'Net connection to work.

Anyone got any ideas?


__________________
Happy Days,
Phil.

"Don't worry, don't hurry -
and don't forget to smell the flowers."

[AlexL]

Recovered from cache:
Posting by : AlexL 12-22-2003 01:03 PM


Re: Magic - !#*@ing magic!


Originally posted by PhilAP
I then tried to connect again using Email. Within seconds the alert
"SocketServer
LDR- IMPORT
Reason number 2"
appeared. Under it another alert said
"Server has closed".




The above error is produced by trying to use the SIS file for devices with ethernet installed on a device which does not have ethernet drivers installed. Either use the Non-ethernet SIS file or use the IrLAN SIS file (Note Installing IrLAN when you aren't actually going to use it is just going to waste memory.)

Alex.

[AlexL]

Originally posted by Global
Thank you very much, Alex. But there is something I don't understand. With a 7book sometimes I use ethernet/LAN and sometimes an infrared connection to a GSM phone. So which update should I use?
Global

Basicly if you have ethernet drivers installed (i.e. Ethernet Applet in Control Panel) then install the Ethernet SIS file, If you don't have ethernet installed then install the non-ethernet SIS file. If you do not have ethernet but would like to use IrLAN then install the IrLAN SIS file. (Note: Installing IrLAN when you are not going to use it is simply wasting your memory)

The ethernet & IrLAN SIS files have basicly the same TCP/IP Stack as the non-Ethernet SIS file, except it has the additional ethernet extensions. Which means you can use it for both Dial-Up / GPRS and Ethernet, i.e. you do not need to switch between the two.

Alex.

[marct]

Hi there,

being the proud owner of an MC218 and having encountered frozen/slow/dropped inet connections over the past months, I would just like to make sure: as far as I know there are some differences between the 5MX and the MC218 that are mainly software related. I'm not sure if this concerns applications, or extends to the ER5.
Is it safe to assume that the tcpip stack on the MC218 is identical to the 5MX so that I can use the sis files without risk ?

Thanks,
Marc

[MikeMcC]

Is it safe to assume that the tcpip stack on the MC218 is identical to the 5MX so that I can use the sis files without risk ? Yes ;)

The MC218 does have some additional software that isn't present in the 5mx, but the basic machine is the same - there is no difference in the internet connectivity software.

[UScharlie]

Netbook ver. 158 (with ethernet in control panel)

I download TCP/IP update and have attempted to install the ethernet only update. The installer runs - but comes up with the following:

"Missing Dependancy"

"Comms components (TCP/IP)" has not been installed.
Please install "Comms Components (TCP/IP)" and try again.

The IrLan update installs but I have removed it following the advice that it should only be used if a Ir phone/modem is used. I only use Wi-Fi or Gold Card modem for internet connections and have had issues with Opera freezing the Netbook.

Any advice ??

Thanks

Charlie

[MikeMcC]

"Comms components (TCP/IP)" has not been installed.
Please install "Comms Components (TCP/IP)" and try again This error usually arises when you try to install from the PC via PsiWin, an application which requires the TCP/IP componenents. The installer is looking for them in "C" drive and, as they are in ROM (or in the case of a netBook, the protected area of RAM), it cannot find them. The solution is normally to transfer the .SIS file to the Psion and run it there instead.

[UScharlie]

Mike,

I am infact trying to install the update by running the .SIS file on the netbook. It gives me the option to install the update on either C, D, E drives. I still get the same error regardless of which drive I select.

Initally I had installed the Irlan update but have since removed it - on realising it was only useful if using an Ir modem/phone. (?)

I've soft reset the nB - Atime is installed could this be affecting it?

Any help would be great.

Thanks

Charlie

[MikeMcC]

Charlie,

I did chose my words carefully when I said "This error usually arises " and "The solution is normally..." ;)

I know that the problem can arise in other circumstances, but I don't know why or what the solution then is.

What you can do, is to download a copy of "nSISUtil" (free) from Neuon's website (http://www.neuon.com) and use that to extract the files from the .SIS installation archive. They can then be copied directly into the appropriate path. The files are:

TCP/IP Update (Non-Ethernet)
ND_DLGSV.DLL
Tcpip.prt

TCP/IP Update (Ethernet)
Tcpip.prt

and the path is the same for all C:\System\Libs\ or D:\System\Libs\

[jayempayne]

Hi,

I have been mortified for the last couple of months thinking my 5mx was dying on me and I was going to have to look elsewhere for a second brain. I have tried hard resets etc.. but obviously to no avail. Then, by accident, searching for Irda problems thinking mine may be faulty, I was referred here and simply have to say THANKYOU to everyone involved. My psion is alive again and I have been utterly fascinated reading this thread from the beginning.

Once again, me heartfelt thanks to everyone involved, I just wish I had found ths thread a month ago as it made for a miserable Christmas having to send Emails using my PC! Yuck!

John

[netBookBabe]

Welcome to Psion Place, John - better late than never, and glad to hear your problem is resolved. Hope you'll stick around for a while now that you've found us! :)

Julie

[MickKi]

Hi Charlie,
Originally posted by UScharlie
Initally I had installed the Irlan update but have since removed it - on realising it was only useful if using an Ir modem/phone. (?)
As I understand it, Irlan is very much what it says: you can see it as a driver which enables the Psion to connect to a LAN, using Ir (as opposed to a physical cable), over TCP/IP.

You can connect to an Ir modem or phone using the plain vanilla patch (non-ethernet).

Anyway, if you had installed the Irlan and it worked why not reinstal it once more - it may use slightly more memory but the Netbook isn't exactly short on resources (compared to its smaller brothers).

Regards,

Mick

[fabfabfab]

Just thanks.

the Non ethernet update worked fine in my case. revo was freezing before each time I was donwloading email headers, not anymore.

Can't understand why Psion didn't post it on their website, as an update to Epoc, but I'm glad I found it anyway (even though took me half a day of research...).

Cheers,

Fabrice

[Marion]

Hello from France !
I use a Psion 5mx and a Nokia 6310i. I usually connect to the internet via my mobile phone line provider (SFR), since it also provides access to the Internet, and it works well, with no freeze. But the special number they give to roam the internet can't be used abroad. So I tried the FAI Free, and you can just add ze to its name. But I'm happy to report that the freeware Sink2, which I discovered on the french Psion club web site, ended the problem. I found it on http://www.cabuzel.com/psion/indexnew.php?&menu=actu&sousmenu=liste
Ther you find anote on "la fin des problèmes entre les FAI et Psion" (end of problems between you guess what) and you can download Sink2. It is small and the download is so quick you wonder if it's been done but it is.

[netBookBabe]

Hi Marion, welcome to Psion Place. :)

Like you, quite a number of our members here have reported success using Sink to solve current connectivity/freezing problems with their Psions. Definitely to be recommended to anyone who is still struggling.

Julie

[RSS]

Read this post with interest as I've been having problems with the Psion stopping when sending email. I use an NTL account with my username and password all set in the dial up settings. Had this problem where the Psion would freeze, the clock would still run but I could not close the email app or start anything, the only way round this was a soft reset.

Downloaded this sink file and run it to load on the Psion. Have the icon on the task bar but when I run it I get the message

Error running SinkScreen from Sink.jar:
The Java VM does not seem to be installed!

When I loaded sink I was given the option to load source code but it said only needed is I was going to programme (whick I'm not)

What have I done wrong, should I use the sink2 app mentioned and if so where is this?

[MikeMcC]

RSS,The Java VM does not seem to be installed!

What have I done wrong....? You haven't installed the Java Virtual Machine.

You don't mention which model of Psion you are using but, depending on the model and the PsiWin CD that was supplied with it, the Psionjvm.sis file may be on it. In my original copy of 2.3 as supplied with my 5mx, the file is in the \Extras\Internet\ folder.

[RSS]

I'm using the 5mx, I tried the CD but through the auto install selections when I click on Java virtual machine ver 1.0 it fires me off to the Psion web site. Logged on but can't find the Java download?

If I look on the PsiWin CD in the directory you mentioned there are some PDF files, two SIS files Web.sys & MCU.sis and a Java word file but no Psionjvm.sis install file for Java (searched the whole CD).

[MikeMcC]

RSS,no Psionjvm.sis install file for Java (searched the whole CD).OK, I have uploaded a copy to my website, download from Psionjvm.zip (http://www.mgmcc.myby.co.uk/Psionjvm.zip)

[RSS]

Thanks, downloaded the file and added to my Psion.

Ran sink and it took me through the dial up routine, when on line I ran Psion email and sent a couple of emails. So far so good, but I did find the hanging before the sink app would happen when it seemed to feel like it so time will tell.

After sending email is it now normal to have to disconnect the internet dial up manually? Is this because Sink will keep it open even when the emails have been sent? Not a problem just want to know I'm doing this correctly.

Roy

[MikeMcC]

After sending email is it now normal to have to disconnect the internet dial up manually? Is this because Sink will keep it open even when the emails have been sent? Not a problem just want to know I'm doing this correctly.Disconnecting is normally governed by the setting in "Control Panel / Internet" - On exit, stay online for... but as I haven't used 'Sink', I don't know if it changes anything. Someone else may be able to comment.

[Marion]

Hello from France
Sink2 helps me twice : to connect to the Internet via the ISP Free with my mobile, and alos to send mails using Wanadoo as an ISP and a Diamond Mako 56k travel modem with my 5 mx. I just have to open Sink2 and have it running before I open the email app. After the session, I use "disconnect from the internet" in the email menu, and I also close Sink2. It woks perfectly and I have not even loaded le jvm sis file. But it probably depends on my providers. If, with yours, you are in need of jvm, you might also be in need of smtpauth to email smoothly. I've seen our dear Mike has the file on his web site.
Marion

[hlub]

Beacause apparently people still find Sink2 useful, I updated the program a bit (It now has icons on the sidebar, and the help file has been updated to mention ALex L's TCP/IP patch)

It can still be found via http://utopia.knoware.nl/~hlub/uck/software/
(which also has a link to Alex's patch)

I definitely think that the TCP/IP upgrade is the more thorough and definititive solution, and that you should try it before Sink2.

This said, Sink2 works for me, and uses very little space on my machine.

[RSS]

Thanks for the update, the OPL version of Sink would be a better one to use as I can then unload Java.

That being said I'll try the TCPIP patch first after I've removed both Sink and Java and test.

Your link was fine and I've downloaded both files to load tonight.

Regards

Roy

[stolkjo]

I tried to PM Alex but I don't think he has this option turned on. Therefore I'll try it this way:

Alex,

Since you put out much appriciated TCP patch out there would you mind having a look at my thread at:
http://www.pdastreet.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=42707
and shine your light on this matter? More info about the research I did on the TCP receive window at
http://www.johnstolk.com/Psion/TCP/index.htm

Thanks,

John

[jdunn]

USCharlie had trouble using TCP/IP update (on Netbook) in Jan getting the error:

"Comms components (TCP/IP)" has not been installed.
Please install "Comms Components (TCP/IP)" and try again "

MikeMcC suggested copying files:

ND_DLGSV.DLL
Tcpip.prt

to system/libs folder. I've got the same problem on a series 7. I've copied the 2 files from my 5mx with no joy. Anyone managed to fix this please.